HELP! new SiS648 chipset and memory question!

Sunny129 · Post by **Sunny129** » Mon Jul 22, 2002 1:00 pm

i would like to know:
1) when exactly this chipset will be available for purchase?
2) is there any other mobo manufacturer besides Shuttle who plans on making a board with this chipset anytime soon?
3) with the capability to use DDR400 memory, how will this chipset compare to Intel's i850E/RDRAM combination as far as bandwidth and performance go?
4) although the SiS648 doesn't officially support DDR400 memory, it has been tested by hardware reviewers and has been found to work fine. the official specs say that all 3 DIMMs can be filled with DDR266, and only 2 DIMMs can be filled with DDR333, all with a total memory capacity of 3GB. how many DIMMs can be filled with DDR400 memory? the hardware reviews failed to mention that, unless i missed something...

thanks...eric

wvjohn · Post by **wvjohn** » Mon Jul 22, 2002 2:50 pm

there was a review of it around somewhere this morning - you might check the major hw boards - i recall the article saying that all the major manufacturers would be using it - I have an MSI board with the 645, and lothough the options are a bit limited on my board, the chipset it pretty fast

nexus_7 · Post by **nexus_7** » Mon Jul 22, 2002 3:13 pm

overclockers.com was ragging on it this AM I think...but it looks like a good setup to me. I would expect End of month to mid next onth befor it is easly avaiable by many places.

Greg

Sunny129 · Post by **Sunny129** » Mon Jul 22, 2002 4:17 pm

wvjohn,

what are some of the other major HW forums?

nexus_7,

Tom's Hardware Guide did a review on the new chipset, and from what i got out of it, they liked it alot. they liked the fact that it is the first chipset to officially support DDR400 memory. on top of that, they liked Shuttle's AS45 v1.2 mobo (the first mobo to use the SiS648 chipset) b/c of features such as IEEE1394 firewire, serial ATA, USB 2.0, Ultra-DMA 133, etc. i would say Tom's is one of the more reputable hardware review sites, but i'll have to read the article @ overclockers.com and see what they didn't like about it. if there is one reason why i might hesitate to get this board, its b/c i don't know much about the quality, stability, and reliability of Shuttle mobos. i've always used ASUS mobos b/c they are the most stable mobos right behind intel (and you can't OC an intel board)...anyways, i'm trying to decide between this and Intel's i850E chipset, and with the difference in chipset/mobo prices and memory prices, the SIS648 is looking really good right now...

Sunny129 · Post by **Sunny129** » Mon Jul 22, 2002 6:08 pm

well i read that article @ overclockers.com. it really wasn't ragging on the new SiS648 chipset. rather it was saying that, all other things (components) being equal in a system, the 10% performance gap shown by most hardware review sites that SiS and VIA chipsets will give you over an intel chipset, basically diminishes, and in some cases, the system w/ the SiS or VIA chipset you thought you were getting a performance edge out of turns out to be a bit worse than if you were to go with a system using an intel chipset. basically the article is a load of sh!t. in trying to prove what the author is saying, he not only shows that the performance gap one initially has by going with a SiS or VIA chipset over an intel chipset is minimal, but he also shows that once the gap diminishes (and in some cases the system ends up being worse than the intel chipset based system you were originally comparing to), the system w/ the intel chipset is only marginally better. what does all this mean? well, you can shell out X amount of dollars for a system w/ an intel chipset and possibly RDRAM, only to have marginal performance gains over another system...OR you can pay alot less for a system using a SiS or VIA chipset and DDR SDRAM who's performance is not quite as good as the system w/ the intel chipset, but the performance gap is so small that it is arbitrary.

Sunny129 · Post by **Sunny129** » Mon Jul 22, 2002 7:14 pm

another question...i edited my original post to include it, but i don't know how many people will see it up there, so i thought i would post the question down here too...

although the SiS648 doesn't officially support DDR400 memory, it has been tested by hardware reviewers and has been found to work fine. the official specs say that all 3 DIMMs can be filled with DDR266, and only 2 DIMMs can be filled with DDR333, all with a total memory capacity of 3GB. how many DIMMs can be filled with DDR400 memory? the hardware reviews failed to mention that, unless i missed something...

chottoED · Post by **chottoED** » Tue Jul 23, 2002 1:40 am

it's amazing how far SiS has come from being just a rinky dink no namer to actually a rinky dink company that has gained the respect and quite a few dollars out of us aftermarket folk...

the SiS735 got my attention... and the SiS645DX has now earned my respect... i can't wait for their new releases to flush out into the open

MAC · Post by **MAC** » Mon Jul 29, 2002 4:23 pm

There are reviews of the SIS 648 motherboards at the following locations

Anand Tech

FiringSquad

Both reviewers were impressed with the motherboards. According to the reviews, most major motherboard manufacturers should have motherboards based on the SIS 648 chipset. Hopefully one of the manufacturers will produce a fully equipped motherboard designed for over-clocking and high end PCs. According to the reviews, motherboard with the SIS 648 chip should start showing up in August.

The review at Firing Squad showed that the SIS 648 motherboard equipped with a P4 2.53 GHz chip was approximately 1-2% faster than an Intel 850E motherboard equipped with 1066 RDRAM and the P4 2.53 GHz chipset.

I forget what the review at Anand Tech showed, but I think the SIS 648 chipset and I850E chipset w/ 1066 RDRAM showed similar speeds except for one instance on the Unreal 2003 demo.

As for your question concerning the amount of DDR 400 RAM the board supports; it will only support 2 sticks of DDR 400 RAM.

Hope this information helps.

MAC

Sahakiel · Post by **Sahakiel** » Mon Jul 29, 2002 10:37 pm

Two sticks or two banks? I heard a rumor it was two banks, which would be one helluva mess.

Sunny129 · Post by **Sunny129** » Mon Jul 29, 2002 11:39 pm

its been quite a while since i first posted this thread. since then i've read those reviews and one or two more from some other hardware review sites. but i guess somewhere in there, i failed to see the part about how many DIMMs could be filled with memory rated at certain speeds. i appreciate that info...i've been looking for it for quite some time...

thanks...eric

EDIT - i believe he meant two banks...i just skimmed through one of the reviews and it said two banks...how much of a mess will that cause?

MAC · Post by **MAC** » Tue Jul 30, 2002 8:57 am

Taken from the review of the SIS 648 motherboard on Firing Squad:

"Looking at the basic specs of the memory controller, you’d assume SiS left things virtually unchanged. Memory support is still limited to 3GB (1GB per DIMM, which is the same figure as SiS 645 and SiS 645DX); in comparison Intel 845/845E is also limited to 3GB while VIA P4X333 supports up to 4GB of memory. In addition, only two memory modules are supported in DDR400 and DDR333 modes, while up to three modules of DDR266 are officially approved. If it weren’t for the addition of DDR400 memory, the basic specs would be the same."

Maybe I'm reading the above section wrong, but I equate the number of memory modules supported (2) in DDR 333/400 mode to the number of sticks (2) of DDR 333 or DDR 400 RAM that can be used.

chottoED · Post by **chottoED** » Tue Jul 30, 2002 12:06 pm

Maybe I'm reading the above section wrong, but I equate the number of memory modules supported (2) in DDR 333/400 mode to the number of sticks (2) of DDR 333 or DDR 400 RAM that can be used.

??? Does this sound redundant to anyone here but me?

Sunny129 · Post by **Sunny129** » Tue Jul 30, 2002 1:27 pm

YES...

1 stick of memeory = 1 DIMM (dual inline memory module),

while a memory bank is just the slot on the mobo into which the memory is inserted

Sahakiel · Post by **Sahakiel** » Tue Jul 30, 2002 10:28 pm

A memory bank is not the slot where you insert the memory stick. If you pay attention to your POST or glance through your motherboard manual, you find that each memory stick usually takes up two banks.

Ex: My 8K3A+ has banks 0/1 for DIMM 1, 2/3 for DIMM 2, and 4/5 for DIMM 3. Note six total banks, 3 total slots, 2 banks per slot.

I don't know enough about memory to say whether all memory sticks use both banks or whether there are some sticks sold that use a single bank. I seem to remember seeing a DIMM using a single bank, but I could always be flubbing my memory in a vain attempt to prove a point.

If it's two sticks of memory at two banks each, then it's just a little exasperation. If it's two memory slots at one bank each for a total of two banks, then upgrading will be annoying, especially if it's specifically one bank only.

In the end, though, it would be up to your motherboard manufacturer. Abit was pretty successful implementing four DDR slots while most companies had three slots picky on RAM. A few even ended up with three slots that didn't always work, no matter whose memory you shoved in there.

But, at 200MHz, with no official spec, engineering difficulties and an economic slowdown, I think we would be pretty lucky just to run one stick at this piont.