Justice Department requested from Congress the ability to ask chief judges to indefinitely detain people without trial

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FlyingPenguin
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Justice Department requested from Congress the ability to ask chief judges to indefinitely detain people without trial

Postby FlyingPenguin » Thu Mar 26, 2020 10:37 am

From the backlash, I doubt it will happen, but even the ask is chilling.

Sen. Rand Paul (R-Ky.) went further in his tweet:

“We absolutely must, must, resist government run amok taking advantage of a crisis. This is how your liberty dies. Stand up America and resist.”


https://thehill.com/blogs/congress-blog ... -tradition
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Re: Justice Department requested from Congress the ability to ask chief judges to indefinitely detain people without tri

Postby Losbot » Thu Mar 26, 2020 1:41 pm

Remind me of when Rham Emmanuel said “You never want a serious crisis to go to waste. And what I mean by that is an opportunity to do things that you think you could not do before.”

I don't trust govt in general. We seriously need term limits and no more of the crazy perks. People should be wanting to do good for the nation and not lining their pockets. Too many control freaks though in govt.
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Re: Justice Department requested from Congress the ability to ask chief judges to indefinitely detain people without tri

Postby psypher » Thu Mar 26, 2020 3:40 pm

Losbot wrote:Remind me of when Rham Emmanuel said “You never want a serious crisis to go to waste. And what I mean by that is an opportunity to do things that you think you could not do before.”

I don't trust govt in general. We seriously need term limits and no more of the crazy perks. People should be wanting to do good for the nation and not lining their pockets. Too many control freaks though in govt.

What's wrong with what he said?

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Re: Justice Department requested from Congress the ability to ask chief judges to indefinitely detain people without tri

Postby Losbot » Sat Mar 28, 2020 12:11 pm

psypher wrote:
Losbot wrote:Remind me of when Rham Emmanuel said “You never want a serious crisis to go to waste. And what I mean by that is an opportunity to do things that you think you could not do before.”

I don't trust govt in general. We seriously need term limits and no more of the crazy perks. People should be wanting to do good for the nation and not lining their pockets. Too many control freaks though in govt.

What's wrong with what he said?


I figured you'd not see a problem with that. LOL
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Re: Justice Department requested from Congress the ability to ask chief judges to indefinitely detain people without tri

Postby psypher » Sun Mar 29, 2020 7:11 pm

Losbot wrote:
psypher wrote:
Losbot wrote:Remind me of when Rham Emmanuel said “You never want a serious crisis to go to waste. And what I mean by that is an opportunity to do things that you think you could not do before.”

I don't trust govt in general. We seriously need term limits and no more of the crazy perks. People should be wanting to do good for the nation and not lining their pockets. Too many control freaks though in govt.

What's wrong with what he said?


I figured you'd not see a problem with that. LOL


What? about actually taking the opportunity to learn from something and working on preventing it from happening again in the future? You're just repeating the same cherry picked parts of a quote that you heard somewhere. How about you post the full quote?

Emanuel, Nov. 19, 2008 wrote:You never want a serious crisis to go to waste. And what I mean by that is an opportunity to do things that you think you could not do before. I think America as a whole in 1973 and 1974, and not just my view but obviously the administration's, missed the opportunity to deal with the energy crisis that was before us. For a long time our entire energy policy came down to cheap oil. This is an opportunity, what used to be long-term problems, be they in the health care area, energy area, education area, fiscal area, tax area, regulatory reform area, things that we have postponed for too long, that were long-term, are now immediate and must be dealt with. This crisis provides the opportunity, for us, as I would say, the opportunity to do things that you could not do before. The good news, I suppose, if you want to see a silver lining, is the problems are big enough that they lend themselves to ideas from both parties for the solution.


And this is more recent
Amid negotiations over how lawmakers should respond to the coronavirus pandemic, Rahm Emanuel has reprised his famous rallying cry from his 2008 financial crash: Never let a crisis go to waste.

Speaking during an interview on ABC’s “This Week” on Sunday, the former Chicago mayor and chief of staff to President Barack Obama brought back his infamous quote from the 2008 financial collapse in an attempt to highlight that the government can learn from its mistakes when dealing crises.

“Never allow a crisis to go to waste,” Emanuel said Sunday. “Start planning for the future. This has to be the last pandemic that creates an economic depression. We're going to have more pandemics, but this has to be the last economic depression.


BTW Losbot, I'm a card carrying registered Republican with a conceal carry :) I just happen to put my Country first and listen to both sides and cut through the bullshit spun from both the media on both sides as well as the parties from both sides.

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Re: Justice Department requested from Congress the ability to ask chief judges to indefinitely detain people without tri

Postby Losbot » Mon Mar 30, 2020 10:29 am

What happened with the virus bill though was not about making this the last Pandemic. They pushed through a bunch of bullshit that was completely unrelated to helping people out.
Like some $25M for the JFK Performing Arts Center? Really? And for what? Apparently hours after everything went through so they'd get their money, they told performers they would not be getting paid. LOL

I look at both sides and despite his stupid tweets, sometimes off-the-rails rants about stupid shit or that he's all about his image, I do believe he gives a damn about this country, more so than other politicians. I would have loved to see what he could have done if he wasn't spending all his time tweeting nonsense or having to constantly fight with the Democrats, who were talking impeachment since before he even took the oath of office. It was destined to be a shitshow from day 1 IMHO. Yeah, he's not what I'd consider "Presidential material" and I didn't vote for him in the primaries but I didn't want Hillary, as I trust her less than I would a home intruder with a gun pointed to my head.

The Left has been shooting themselves in the foot since day 1 and I've seen a lot of Dems talk about how they're upset that the part has been obsessed with Trump's removal instead of focusing on their job.

Either way, we're all getting screwed.
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Re: Justice Department requested from Congress the ability to ask chief judges to indefinitely detain people without tri

Postby psypher » Mon Mar 30, 2020 12:25 pm

Losbot wrote:What happened with the virus bill though was not about making this the last Pandemic. They pushed through a bunch of bullshit that was completely unrelated to helping people out.
Like some $25M for the JFK Performing Arts Center? Really? And for what? Apparently hours after everything went through so they'd get their money, they told performers they would not be getting paid. LOL

I look at both sides and despite his stupid tweets, sometimes off-the-rails rants about stupid shit or that he's all about his image, I do believe he gives a damn about this country, more so than other politicians. I would have loved to see what he could have done if he wasn't spending all his time tweeting nonsense or having to constantly fight with the Democrats, who were talking impeachment since before he even took the oath of office. It was destined to be a shitshow from day 1 IMHO. Yeah, he's not what I'd consider "Presidential material" and I didn't vote for him in the primaries but I didn't want Hillary, as I trust her less than I would a home intruder with a gun pointed to my head.

The Left has been shooting themselves in the foot since day 1 and I've seen a lot of Dems talk about how they're upset that the part has been obsessed with Trump's removal instead of focusing on their job.

Either way, we're all getting screwed.


Who is they? Democrats? Trump defended the $25M for the JFK Performing Arts Center and personally approved it. Anyways, that bill has nothing to do with long term changes which is what those quotes referred to. This bill is just a short term band-aid, it's just dumping money. Long term changes that are spun from a crisis are things like bank reforms after the 2008 mess and going back further, Social Security is another example that was born from a crisis (the Great Depression). What kind of long term changes am I hoping come out of this? Making internet access a utility and stop these bullshit games that AT&T/Comcast/etc... play. Seriously, all of a sudden bandwidth caps aren't an issue?!?!? Companies getting pushed to making remote work succeed might finally address necessary commutes/traffic. Hell, LA might finally have blue skies again! Actually bringing back some manufacturing to US and rely less on foreign manufactures, especially for critical/essential supplies. Address deficiencies in our health care system.

The thing is it doesn't matter how much you love this country, a horrible leader is still a horrible leader at the end of the day and when he has the final decision, it can be extremely devastating as we've seen over and over again. A great leader understands that there are experts that dedicate their lives to their fields and that is who you turn to. Going with your gut and ignoring science is just flat out irresponsible. A great leader doesn't go on Hannity say one thing one day and a few days later, flat out say he didn't say it. The guy barely constitutes "human being" material. You talk about not trusting Hilary, but how can you trust Trump when you can easily watch all his press conferences/interviews of him constantly lying? Do you honestly believe that when Trump lies it's just "dumb shit"? I can't believe you actually believe that. But we do agree on one thing, I didn't want Hilary either, but mostly because I felt it was time to have a Republican president, just wish it wasn't Trump.

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Re: Justice Department requested from Congress the ability to ask chief judges to indefinitely detain people without tri

Postby FlyingPenguin » Mon Mar 30, 2020 1:03 pm

I wasn't sure, originally, where you were going psypher, but I follow you now.

I agree that, bad as this is, it may indeed force some changes for the better.

You are entirely correct that this completely blows the whole rationale for data caps out of the water. I haven't seen it anywhere yet, but I would love to see some graphs comparing overall load on the Internet backbones now VS two months ago. I'm just guessing, but I wouldn't be surprised if it's easily doubled. Yet somehow the Internet hasn't collapsed under it's own weight.

Even more interesting would be to see the difference in loads on individual ISP networks, but those companies don't release that data publicly.

There is also absolutely no excuse for a pandemic like this to catch this country's administration by surprise again in the future, no matter who is in charge. We'd better damn well have proper stockpiles, guidelines, and reinstituting a full time government pandemic panel to maintain a vigilant posture so that we're ahead of the game next time with supplies and planning.

And maybe. MAYBE. Republicans won't treat scientists and researchers like an annoyance in the future. It's not just Trump. The past four or five Republican administrations have pretty much treated scientists like they're ignorant children who don't understand that scientific facts are less important than political considerations, and the budget.

Unless they're scientists designing weapons, of course.
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