Soldier responds to Michael Moore's Movie

[Karchiveur]

Originally posted by sbp
You say both sides of view should be shown but are going to a one-sided "documentary" that has dubious tales presented as fact. Brilliant Karchiveur. cratch

uhh, no I was refering to the "documentary" as being the left side of things.. since all the soldiers are already well educated on the right. cratch

[Executioner]

Any of you guys get HBO and watch Real Time with Bill Maher? He had Mike Moore on their with 2 conservatives - one from California Rep. David Dreir, and the governor of Colorado Bill Owens. Man, they had some very heated exchanges between MM and Dave Dreir. I was almost expecting MM to tell Dave Dreir to fvck off, as they commented on the movie documentary. I still have not see it yet, as I'm looking for a copy to download.

What I thought was very funny was at the end of the show, where both Mike Moore and Bill Maher got on their knees to convince Ralph Nader not to run. LOL Are these guys that desperate?

http://www.hbo.com/billmaher/episode/index.html

[blade]

So sorry. I forgot this was the Political BS Forum *As long as all topics are pro-Bush, Army, and other neo-con agendas.*

Did I say you <i>can't</i> speak your peace? You did, and others and I spoke ours.


I've never kept up with politics since seeing how LBJ came across on TV, the nixon fiasco and how each party bad mouth the other and dig up any dirt they can. I'm not demo or pub. I'm not leftwing, rightwing or middlewing. I am not liberal or unliberal. I can't even tell you the differences. That's how much I keep up with politics.

All the bickering keeps me away. I only started to keep up some since 9/11.

I do admit I voted for carter (oops) and reagan. Since then, none have impressed me so I haven't voted.


Just weeks ago more jets were found hidden in sand in Iwreck. Those are huge compared to most wmd's. Then consider Iwreck had what, 8-12 months to hide and/or send out wmd's. Thanks to france. It may be years before any are found, if ever. But I have no doubt he had them, or had easy access to them.

Even IF he never had any, I still believe getting him out was in the world's best interest. He's a potential Hitler.

Moore is a complete disgrace. His opinionated and fact-twisting movie (going by most reviews) will lead to more American deaths. He should be shot. Beheaded would be moore deserving though.

I do believe Bush did what he honestly felt was in the best interests of America. Only a fool would believe that bin laden and insane would not eventually join forces against their common enemy. Us, the infidels, non-believers. You know, those who don't believe in their bible, the corn. Because we are violating their 'holy ground', and support Israel. duh yeah good reasons

I am backing Bush. The Johns seem too fake and too intent in trying to tell us what 'they think' we want to hear, just to get in power.

[Lmandrake]

Taking a page from others in this thread:

You pathetic neo-con pieces of . The instant anybody says anything critical about the decisions of politically elected officials to take this country to war, it instantly becomes an attack on the military - particularly the footsoldiers who have to fight and die - followed by the familiar rant about how these soldiers are protecting our freedom to do all those scummy "liberal" things that drive you to distraction.


Its a cheap and despicable response.

My kids are the same age as the kids in uniform serving over there. If there was a draft with no college deferments - as there should have been during Viet Nam - they would be serving now. Hell, two years of military service would do them both some good...

I respect the kids serving in uniform. They could be my kids. Most important, they are somebody else's kids and are loved as much, or more, as mine are.

I respect their chain of command until you get to the very top.

If I criticize the war, the President, Donald Rumsfeld etc., why is it an attack on the poor soldier? Because you want it to be - it fulfills your deeply held belief that "liberals" and "demorats" hate America and you - who love it - are defending it. So wrap yourself in the flag, take out the icon of the poor valiant soldier and start clubbing the nearest traitorous "hippie" with it.

Well, I don't hate this country. I love it. I just have a different vision about certain things than the rest of you. And that's ok, because this type of argument/split has been going on for as long as there was a Constitution. However, don't come back at me with this "if you criticize the war, you must hate the poor soldier," bull . It's not that way. I respect the soldier, I respect his service, I respect the military. If I think the leaders who put the soldier in harm's way are wrong, it in no way lessens my awareness that a young person is risking their life honorably and selflessly.

And if you want an example of disrespect for sacrifice, look no further than the ban on any media coverage of the dead kids coming back from Iraq. We sure don't want the public to see that flag-draped aluminum box come off that plane, because that's the kind of truth we don't want them to know.

[robbie]

Originally posted by Karchiveur
If theres one film i want to see its this one, it hits the local theater nearing the end of this month...
Bah ya...
if only the army would show all these guys both sides of view before they went to war. how many ya think would actually sign up? no nearly as many.. thus, its damn near brainwash (too strong of a word i know) what the army/gov' is doing to there soldiers. HAH! good too see peeps 2nd guessing about going to war... because most are only hearing on side of it all!

Last time I checked, they signed up WILLINGLY!!! Some even probably AFTER 9/11.
Rob

[PreDatoR]

Originally posted by robbie
Last time I checked, they signed up WILLINGLY!!! Some even probably AFTER 9/11.
Rob

nevermind him... he can't help it he lives in canadia...

[TruckStuff]

Originally posted by rogue
So wait, the armed forces are defending my freedom by being over in Iraq and killing so called "terrorists"? Thats a new one. Typical from your point of view though, as is your knee-jerk reaction to anything badmouthed about the Army. Oh yes, I get it alright. So the price of freedom is being a mindless, brainwashed zombie that swallows everything the government spoon-feeds them huh?

Ummm... how do you think they are NOT defneding your freedom? Lets remember that a whole group of terrorists came over here and killed 3,000 Americans two and a half years ago. Simply because our enemy is not a sovereign nation and does not have a clearly recognizable leadership structure doesn't make the threat any less real. And the price of freedom is the sacrifice that is being paid by our men and women in uniform. But thanks for trying that one...

Originally posted by rogue
Kind of like what ole Dub did with the WMD information, the Saddam-Al Qaeda link and the invasion of Iraq, eh? Talk about distortion of facts!

My how quickly we forget that the entire world is an record stating that Saddam had WMD: Bush, Blair Rice, Rumsfeld, Clinton, Albright, Kofi Annan, and a certain nameless senator from Massachusetts. Hindsight is 20/20 and to sit here not and bitch about how BUSH should have done something then is a pretty one-sided point-of-view.

Originally posted by rogue
They may have not much in the way of smarts, but they shouldn't be lied to either. Anyways, if they can't handle the "powerful influence" of a propagandist movie like Fahrenheit 9/11, then what the hell are they doing fighting a war and carrying guns?

Because smart or not, they believe in something greater than themselves. They believe that there are things in this country worth fighting (and dieing) for. They believe that the foundations of this country are worth defending. Things that you comments CLEARLY indicate you care nothing about. Like most liberals, you don't care about anything beyond yourself, but I digress...

Originally posted by rogue
No wonder some are going apeshit and killing women and children. Some "professional" army

How can you make comments like this and expect conservatives to NOT get pissed off at you? You have just degraded every single member of the the greatest military force known to man and reduced them to the level of barbarians. Do you REALLY expect anyone to listen to you when you do that? Or are you just interested in further stirring the cauldron pot of your fellow liberals and inflaming hatred and intolerance of conservatives? Just curious...

Originally posted by rogue
I'll agree that there is a limit to free speech, but comparing this movie to running into a crowded thater and yelling "FIRE" is about as an ludicrous example as they come.

And presenting this movie, as you have done in this thread, as facts that that the US military should fear is equally ludicrous.

[TruckStuff]

Originally posted by Lmandrake
You pathetic neo-con pieces of . The instant anybody says anything critical about the decisions of politically elected officials to take this country to war, it instantly becomes an attack on the military - particularly the footsoldiers who have to fight and die - followed by the familiar rant about how these soldiers are protecting our freedom to do all those scummy "liberal" things that drive you to distraction.

You say that as if the entire US military hasn't been attacked and compared to barbarians in this thread. Hmmm.....

[Lmandrake]

You say that as if the entire US military hasn't been attacked and compared to barbarians in this thread.

Unless I missed something, Rogue makes one comment about US soldiers killing civilians. That occurred well after the "criticize the war - you must hate the troops" phenomenon kicked into high gear.

That's one sentence in the whole thread.

[stall6g]

Originally posted by Karchiveur
If theres one film i want to see its this one, it hits the local theater nearing the end of this month...
Bah ya...
if only the army would show all these guys both sides of view before they went to war. how many ya think would actually sign up? no nearly as many.. thus, its damn near brainwash (too strong of a word i know) what the army/gov' is doing to there soldiers. HAH! good too see peeps 2nd guessing about going to war... because most are only hearing on side of it all!

WTF are you smoking? No one is brainwashed. As a soldier we do not have the liberty to say no that's not right because that it is conservative thing so I'm not going to take part in your plans. It doesn't work that way. We do the job that we were trained to do and we do it to the best of our ability because if we do not then innocents get hurt or our fellow soldiers. There is a bond in the military that you wouldn't understand unless you have walked a mile in our boots. In other words if you want to make bold statements like this then you better know WTF you are talking about. The news always show the bad things because guess what? Bad news gets higher ratings. Notice you don't see many if at all feel good stories about all of the good things that we are doing there. Keep right on believing that we're all brainwashed and are cold-blooded killers. I can personally say from the times that I have been deployed that the number one thing that made it worthwhile were when the local populace would come up to you and say "thank you for being here. If it weren't for you being here I would still be living in fear." We do make a difference in the ordinary person's life, but that is something that you wouldn't understand or ever experience. Do yourself a favor and sign up for a three year tour and then after it is done come back and tell me you feel the same.

[stall6g]

Originally posted by MK888
Where would we be if people did not sign up for the military? If the soldiers questioned everything that was told to them, we would have no military at all. Keeping soliders in the dark about parts of a situation is done for a lot of reasons. One of the main reasons is moral. How effective is a fighting force of soldiers that is not sure what they are doing is the right thing?

The fighting forces of today are a lot more informed than you think. Most even have some college under them and we tend to read the news as it can be a warning factor that we may be going somewhere.

[The_Frapster]

Hey Stall6g































THANK YOU!!!

[stall6g]

Originally posted by TruckStuff

Do you realy think that these soldiers who enlist right out of high school from Smalltown, West Virginia have enough smarts to think at all? If they did, they would have gone to college and OCS and wouldn't be enlisted. Most of them aren't smart enough to evaluate such material in an objective matter; that's why they have commanding officers to TELL them what to do.

Umm maybe it's just my own personal experience but some of the smartest people in the military that I know are enlisted. There are some rocks don't get me wrong but there are more than a few smart ones out there that tell officers what to do. I run the OCS program in Mass. and the biggest failure rate are those Candidates that did OCS as an enlistment option because you are expecting them to be a leader but they do not know how to take care of themselves yet due to no experience. I have been asked many times to go OCS but I'm not interested other than for the retirement money. I simply enjoy working with soldiers and getting into the weeds aspect.

[stall6g]

Originally posted by rogue



They may have not much in the way of smarts, but they shouldn't be lied to either. Anyways, if they can't handle the "powerful influence" of a propagandist movie like Fahrenheit 9/11, then what the hell are they doing fighting a war and carrying guns? No wonder some are going apeshit and killing women and children. Some "professional" army

That had to be on eof the stupidest things that I have ever read. It's no wonder why I tend to avoid talking politics. If you had half a clue you would be dangerous. Just because a couple of assholes over there do bad things that automatically makes us all bad and unprofessional? Give me a break that is like me saying that since you're from such and such state and they have had 5 murders there this month that you must all be murderers or law breakers. Little Jimmy over there, yeah he's a 24 yr old virgin who is going into the priesthood but watch out he's a bad man because he's from Idaho. Get real.

[MK888]

The fighting forces of today are a lot more informed than you think. Most even have some college under them and we tend to read the news as it can be a warning factor that we may be going somewhere.

I hear ya.... my point was more so on the battlefield. I know that during Vietnam they filtered the news that the troops heard/saw as to not decrease moral. Has that changed?