Computer messed up, plz help!

[TheBattousai]

Okay, my comp is completely f'ed up. It was working one night and then the next morning it was just on the fritz. Everytime I turn it on it never even reaches POST and I hear a clicking sound coming from the speaker. I tried a couple things but nothing has worked. Any ideas as to how I can fix this are greatly appreciated!

[eGoCeNTRoNiX]

And start over from the beginning.. Try running it with just the vidcard, CPU and ram and see what ya get with it out of the case.. GL eGo

[TheBattousai]

Hmmmm. tried that, still the same result. Anyway to tell if something has burned out without having to swap in pieces??? Unfortunately, now I'm now away from home and my swapable parts.... Oh well, any more advise is still greatly appreciated.

[FlyingPenguin]

Random clicking sounds from the speaker are not good. Sounds like the mobo is fried. I've seen this often enough. Usually caused by a surge or a failed capacitor.

Try resetting the CMOS but it doesn't sound hopeful.

[TheBattousai]

Unfortunately, I'm thinking I have to agree with you FP. I removed the battery and also set the jumpers and it didn't seem to have any affect. Any clues as to what caused it though for future reference? I'm ruling out a power surge since I have everything plugged into a UPS.

Onto the next order of business then, getting a new mobo. Any suggestions??? I had a Gigabyte GA-7VAX. I thought they were pretty solid, but shit like this doesn't reinforce my beliefs. Any help is as always appreciated.

System spec:
Athlon XP 2100
2x Kingston 512MB DDR333
Radeon 8500 128MB
Sound Blaster Audigy

[eGoCeNTRoNiX]

I just started burning mine in, in a temporary case, until I get my new stuff.. I was too impatient to wait.. hehe.. But it's got this TBred B at 1900+ w/o a sweat. eGo

[dadx2mj]

Another vote for the 8RDA/8RDA+ I love mine and it has been rock stable with no problems at all. If not the Epox the Asus A7N8X would be another good choice.

[FlyingPenguin]

A UPS in NO WAY prevents a surge. All a UPS does is kick in when the power drops (brown out or blackout). It can't do anything if you get hit with an over-voltage.

To completely avoid damage from a surge you need something called a Line Conditioner - a VERY expensive piece of equipment that the average person is not going to own.

Also surge protectors are no guarantee against surges either. They help, but there's no guarantee.

It may have been a surge, or it may have been a defective cap or regulator on the mobo that finally died. Hard to say.

8RDA+ is a nice board BTW.

[TheBattousai]

How about the A7N8X-X? Is there really that much of a difference?

[canton_kid]

Hey FP,
UPS doesn't prevent surges?
You know alot more than me, which is why I am asking

But I always thought these backup UPSs were supposed to do it all! Condition the line more or less.
Prevent surges, kick in the extra juice in a brown out, kick in all the juice in a total outage, and absorb the over voltage in a surge. Course I don't realy expect them to stop a lighting bolt, but normal stuff yes.

My APC 1100 says garunteed lighting and surge protection right on the box in big letters.

Am I living a false sence of security here?? You know what I have said about my RURAL power company and the problems I have here. Hammered off and on 4 times in a Minute or 2 sometimes, and I am sure I get a surge alot durring those!

I've got all my systems on UPS for that reason about as much as just to prevent outages, though the APC 1100 is the best one I have. The others are much smaller cheaper ones.

So do I need to come up with a better solution here?

[FlyingPenguin]

Line conditioner: http://www.cdw.com/shop/products/default.asp?EDC=20167

If your power is that flaky it might be worth it for the peace of mind.

Actually at $228 that's pretty cheap. They used to be VERY expensive, but I haven't priced one in 8 years.

A UPS does nothing but kick in when the voltage drops. Most UPS's also have a surge protector built in but that's VERY different than a line conditioner. Surge protectors are designed to sink large surges - like from lightning strikes. They won't do squat if your line voltage increases 20 volts, but that's enough to damage some equipment if sustained long enough.

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EDIT
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Here's one for $120: http://www.cdw.com/shop/products/default.asp?EDC=11760
This is a 10 amp unit - enough for one computer and a monitor and (maybe) a laser printer. Laser use a lot of current (NEVER connect a laser to a UPS!!!!). Anything more than that and I'd recommend the $230 20 amp unit I linked above.

CDW has some cheaper ones for $80 they call "Voltage regulators" but I don't like the specs. You want a "line conditioner".


Ultimate protection for a computer is to connect the computer to a surge protector power strip (even though the UPS may have one built in, it generally isn't a very good one and almost never has a protection light to tell you it's working). Then connect the surge protector to the UPS, then connect the UPS to the line conditioner which will connect to the wall.

Also make sure you have a good ground on the wall outlet or your surge protection will be worthless. Hardware store has a simple 3 light tester that lets you know if you have a good ground.

You want to be even better protected, run a dedicated ground wire from the ground lug on your outlet to a cold water pipe outside the house, or a ground rod if your house has one.

As I said above, never connect a laser printer to a UPS (the UPS will shut down and reboot your computer whenever you print - boy do I see that often in offices!) - a UPS can't provide enough power for a laser) but you can and should conenct the laser to the conditioner.

Keep in mind that this will protect you from voltage FLUCTATIONS but there's no absolute protection from a lightning strike.

I've seen sound equipment stored on a wooden palette in a storeroom, not connected to ANYTHING take lightning damage (happened all the time at a race track I worked at). Nearby lightning strike induces a magnetic field which is picked up in the power supply transformer and overvoltages it.

We get VERY bad storms here, and since I'm on a heavily wooded 20 acre ranch, I see lightning strikes hit just outside the window all the time this time of year. When it's bad I always pull the wall plugs on all the delicate equipment.

Lightning is some freaky shit.

[canton_kid]

Thanks Fp,

I took a look at the links and will be thinking about getting one. One question though about Amps and such.

How many does a normal system take? 17" monitor, 450watt p/s, 2 hardrives, DVD burner, Cd burner, printer, so forth. I didn't think it was all that high really, though I expect the monitor has alot of draw on startup! Also I would think the P/s draw would be variable based on how much it's running, not its rating. Is that correct?

I think I have 2 maybe 3 of my systems on the same House 15 amp breaker, plus maybe some lights and a fan. I really need to check that ! Might even be an airconditioner on a computer line? I don't know what breakers are what till one pops and something goes off. I seldom ever pop one though

The way this place is laid out they might all be on seperate lines, I really don't know!
I know My main box and a spare are the same line, but seldom using both at the same time there though.

[FlyingPenguin]

Average computer w/monitor is between 3 and 4 amps ( for you LAN party people that's why you should never connect more than 4 computers to a single 15 amp outlet).

A laser printer uses a lot of juice though - as much as 5 amps when printing, a lot less when idle.

[CaterpillarAssassin]

FP, I dont mean to disagree but I disagree.

An SPS "kicks in" when a sag or a power outage comes by.

But a UPS is different in that its always kicked in. When you plug something into a UPS it is running off the batteries in the UPS. Those batteries are constantly being charged from the outlet that they're plugged into. So this, is effectively a form of a line conditioner, since your simply running off the batteries.


But I could be wrong. If I am please correct me and let me know why i'm wrong. Thanks.

[FlyingPenguin]

But a UPS is different in that its always kicked in. When you plug something into a UPS it is running off the batteries in the UPS.

Really depends on the unit type. There are premium UPS units that act as you describe - it's called a Continous UPS.

Most UPS's (anything under $100 for sure) are called a Standby UPS - only charging with the computer connected straight to the AC line - until the voltage drops below a certain pre-set point and then the inverter kicks in.

On most UPS units you'll actually hear a relay click as it switches the power, but some better units use solid-state switching transistors.

You will notice that a UPS makes a loud humming noise when the inverter is running. The inverter is off when you're not running on batteries.

It's more expensive to make a Continous UPS because you have to engineer it to overcome the inefficiency of converting the voltage from 110 AC to 12VDC and back to 110AC all the time. Continous units also run hotter (the inverter generates heat) and needs extra cooling. They tend to be noisy too (inverter noise and fans) so there's even more expense building in noise dampening. A continuous UPS also needs higher quality components because the inverter is working 24/7 whereas a Standby UPS has a very limited cycle time.

I'm not up on how good modern Continous UPS systems are, but I swear by line conditioners. We used to use them for sound concerts and video projection in situations when we had unreliable power, or were forced to use generators (I used to be a sound engineer). Generators (even big industrial ones) are DEATH for computers and delicate sound equipment unless they're crystal controlled (for frequency stability) or run through a conditioner.

My company used to rent these big-ass washing machine sized conditioners (we're talking units capable of handling 200 amps).

More info: http://computer.howstuffworks.com/question28.htm